I am just wondering what do these two types of divisions look like ESR - i mean there is the deployed/ployed example for intantry divisions (a formation is a division yes?) but do artillery and cavalry all adopt the same arrangements?
and just so i am clear - when movement orders are given they are for the whole formation always only? - is artillery always in a formation and what if it stays unlimbered, does this mean the infantry cant move away from it? because cohesion is then lost?
also why in the diagram on page 57 in Step 2 Conversions are some of the battalions outside of the arc of movement? why couldnt the 5 battalions just move still into a line abreast formation towards the enemy at the forward right?
I am sure there are explanations to all this and perhaps it is my fault or something but as a newcomer i would say these rules are not easy to understand, it always feels like i am reading something that is only half revealed.
but do artillery and cavalry all adopt the same arrangements?
Yes, they do. Also the same for Mixed Formations that include both Infantry and Cavalry.
and just so i am clear - when movement orders are given they are for the whole formation always only?
Order Directives require the Regulating Unit to comply while all other Units remain Cohesive. This is specifically discussed in 5.2.3.Conducting Moves, but also denoted in each of the Directive sections throughout 2.3.Available Formation Directives when indicating what each Directive requires a Formation to do.
is artillery always in a formation and what if it stays unlimbered, does this mean the infantry cant move away from it? because cohesion is then lost?
When Artillery is Committed it must move to a Cohesive location. Once it unlimbers the rest of the Formation is not required to remain Cohesive with it. This is covered in 5.2.1.Required Cohesion.
also why in the diagram on page 57 in Step 2 Conversions are some of the battalions outside of the arc of movement? why couldnt the 5 battalions just move still into a line abreast formation towards the enemy at the forward right?
Correct, as indicated by the text in the example, the two Units outside of range/arc can't move to contact with the target, they have to move to any Cohesive location, there's of course a really high number of Cohesive locations each stand could be moved to and the example shows one.
I am sure there are explanations to all this and perhaps it is my fault or something but as a newcomer i would say these rules are not easy to understand, it always feels like i am reading something that is only half revealed.
So far it appears most all of your questions are specifically and directly answered in the rulebook. That's OK, the purpose of this forum is to ask questions and get answers regardless of whether the question is covered by the rulebook or not. But I think the information you're looking for, mostly so far, is all there.
-David
thanks for the replies, i am pleased that the book will hold the answers to my queries, i guess its hard to process it all and i feel like one has to come to ESR with a different mindset about what i so far was getting familiar with regarding napoleonic wargaming. I love the operational level overall and it feels so much more realistic when it comes to the "Armeefuehrung" of the period.
My other beginner question here then is - is it always the case that ESR battles start with formations moving to objectives/contact etc - what about when it comes to recreating an historical battle like say Borodino where all the forces moved into position more or less the day before and so does one then start the game with already deployed positions, and within cannon range of each other?
i was looking through the rules for more details about battery fire but i think it is all generlised and subsumed under the overall combat rules - how does it work for artillery firing from long range and the opposing side, can the battery just select any enemy unit to threaten? - one cant just target a commander specifically could they? what if arty comes into range of an enemy HQ, and is counter-battery fire a concept in ESR or is it just abstracted within the overall combat phase? - are there even actually HQ locations in ESR? where would napoleon or Kutuzow themselves be on the battlefield
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perhaps this is all laid out in teh campaign guides, though sadly i dont own any of those and now i wonder whether they would be worthwhile still now that the new edition has new stats for units
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My other beginner question here then is - is it always the case that ESR battles start with formations moving to objectives/contact etc - what about when it comes to recreating an historical battle like say Borodino where all the forces moved into position more or less the day before and so does one then start the game with already deployed positions, and within cannon range of each other?
You can certainly do historical battles and pitched battles where everyone is deployed. We have a lot of those in our ESR Campaign Guides. Whether Formations are marching onto the tabletop or staged to begin with, players than can use the same mechanics to manipulate them and stage their attacks.
i was looking through the rules for more details about battery fire but i think it is all generlised and subsumed under the overall combat rules - how does it work for artillery firing from long range and the opposing side, can the battery just select any enemy unit to threaten?
Correct. Artillery has different Threat Values at different ranges. Individual stands (Batteries) of Artillery can't "choose" their target, they must fire based on range and arc (8.5.Determining Threat covers this). Grand Batteries (3.5.Create Grand Battery) have both more options and restrictions.
one cant just target a commander specifically could they?
If a Commander (or their Formation) is inside the Threat Zone of the enemy, they roll for Leader Fate (7.Leader Fate). Army and Force Commanders who are in Personal Command of a Formation (3.2.1.Take Personal Command) are considered to be at elevated risk and suffer a negative modifier in Leader Fate.
and is counter-battery fire a concept in ESR or is it just abstracted within the overall combat phase?
Yes, it is an abstracted concept. The result of counter-battery fire was generally to compel the enemy to rotate batteries out of action (see: 3.7.3.Recall an Asset).
re there even actually HQ locations in ESR? where would napoleon or Kutuzow themselves be on the battlefield
Yes. For instance, Napoléon and Kutuzov's observation posts are denoted in our Borodino scenario in Master of the World, 1812 in Russia.
perhaps this is all laid out in teh campaign guides, though sadly i dont own any of those and now i wonder whether they would be worthwhile still now that the new edition has new stats for units
Our ESR Series 3 Campaign Guides currently available, i.e. 1812-1s3 and Iberia-1s3 both include Series 3 Stats in addition to 2nd Ed. Stats.
-David
thanks, I think i will have to get that 1812 campaign guide nevertheless even if its not going to have all the content for version 3
thanks, I think i will have to get that 1812 campaign guide nevertheless even if its not going to have all the content for version 3
The Series 3 Campaign Guides are compatible with Series 3.
-David
great, well i just put an order trhough for the Masters of the World campaign guide!
also is it possible for one to determine cohesion values going off the stats from version 2?
great, well i just put an order trhough for the Masters of the World campaign guide!
Hope you enjoy! We'll get it out as fast as we can.
also is it possible for one to determine cohesion values going off the stats from version 2?
No, though we will be publishing them shortly for download – we'd hoped to already but have been slowed down. They aren't terribly difficult to extrapolate from any of the Series 3 Campaign Guides though either and are also available for English, French, and Russians via our Stats & Orders Packs.
-David
what are the stats and orders packs - are you just meaning the french,english and russian packs available on the shop but which are still for pre-order? I wont have enough to also order those, so will just wait for them to be downloadable
